[Notes on interview with Dr. George and Anna Simkins by William H. Chafe]

              1 ' (
Interview with Dr. and Mrs, George Simkins, July 19, 1972
Most of the following is with Mrs. Simkins. Her husband came in and
out.
Mrs. S. came here 21 years ago. Mr. S. was born here and they live in the
house his father built and he was born in. She came in 1951 from Charleston,
then Winston-Salem — graduated 1946 from college — a No. schl, Penn State.
George went to Herzel, then Talladega, then Mahari.
Mrs. S's father was a civil rights lawyer before it was fashionable — father
went yo Yale, then practiced in Houston — Jay Alston Atkins — once of the
1st black lawyers to practice before the Supreme Court in the Texas White
Primary Case.
George would have been known as a conservative, except in civil rights (their
daughter calls her grandparents "Victorian")
pMrs. S's background accustomed her to the fight, and her father has been
] one of George's staunchest aids — he came out of retirement to take the
C golf case, Dec. 7, 1955
She remembers the Klan in Texas — led a sheltered life — travel was
[the only time she came face to face with the reality of segregation, and
(then the family made special arrangements to avoid problems — private
schools, etc/
In the early 1950's she was morehopeful than she is now ~ then she had
"possibly rather limited goals in light of the present time." — like
public accomodations, going downtown with ease, attending .concerts,
not sitting in the back of the bus — things that the law could change^,
"specific things.
All of us considered the '54 decision a great victory? — great deal of
hope, but In the 1st 12-15 years it didn't matgHaHw — her general
•ghought was that whites and blacks would be going to school" together —
there seemed a possibility for something better, especially for our children —
she knew what black schools were like and how unequal they were.
Dr. S. comes in here and says "When I got into the courts and saw the injustice ■
Judges grinning, witnesses lying," it was disillusioning and embittering —
arrested in golf case — the city leased the white course for a $1 to the
chairman of the Recreation dep't — he and his friends decided to challegge
this and on a Wednesday afternoon they wwent out — the pro cursed and
threatened them 444I4M4<L — whY were they there? — "for a cause" —
what cause? — "the cause of democracy" — the guy followed them around cursing
and at night the police came by. to arrest them —
Did they have wide support for what they did? — lost of blacks didn't
agree with what they'd done — why? — possibly because in general things were
not as bad here as in Montgomery where the other demos were going on — GB
a moreliberal place at least by reputation — there's more support where things
are worse (of course not many blacks played golf which might have had most to
do with the absence of popular support).
If fl